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Webmonkeyuk
15-10-2009, 08:47 PM
right guys im looking for my first venture into machine polishing and have found this post, so i was just wondering do these cheap polishers work as a first step into the machine world?

i have been looking at these 2 and which do you think would be the best

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Power+Tools/Silverline+Pro/Pro+125mm+Random+Orbital+Sander+230v/d40/sd2796/p96383

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?isSearch=true&fh_search=0000005179565&x=19&y=13

how do you go about putting the pads on these things and what would be the best option of pads for starting up?

anewman
16-10-2009, 12:30 AM
i have been looking at these 2 and which do you think would be the best

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Power+Tools/Silverline+Pro/Pro+125mm+Random+Orbital+Sander+230v/d40/sd2796/p96383

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?isSearch=true&fh_search=0000005179565&x=19&y=13

how do you go about putting the pads on these things and what would be the best option of pads for starting up?

The first is a little underpowered at 300 watts. The second may be OK with 400 watts. Pads fit with a velcro hook and loop system. Pads depends on backing pad size. If this is 125mm most recommend menzerna 135mm orange and yellow pads.

Edit: I believe the MacAllister one referred to below by Viper is http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1255715617826&isSearch=true

VIPER
16-10-2009, 01:52 PM
Rule the first one out straight away as it's underpowered as said above, doesn't appear to have a variable speed and the design looks more like a 'palm' sander, and you need proper handles (ideally 2), not be holding, steering and maintaining downward pressure from so high up on the machine.

The second one seems better, but tbh. the revised MaxAllister that has been featured earlier on, looks to be much more suitable machine. Upon initial inspection of the pics, the counter weight looks to be larger than other simlarly specced machines and so should, in theory, reduce any bogging down issues and maintain spin speed under load.

egraphixstudios
24-10-2009, 09:29 PM
im planning on using some Meguiars #85 polish with the new MacAllister polisher.

Can some recommend some polishing pads that will work with the MAC polisher out of the box?

mellowfellow
28-10-2009, 09:32 AM
#1725

Webmonkeyuk
28-10-2009, 04:21 PM
just wondering if this is an orbital polisher and is it anygood?


http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Clearance/Power+Tools/Pro+180mm+Sander+Polisher+230v/d50/sd3150/p35104

also what is a good price for a Kestrel DAS-6 and what selection of pads would be the best for a newbie, its a bit mind boggling with all the choice

VIPER
28-10-2009, 05:17 PM
No, that's a rotary :thumb:

Look at paying about £70-80 ish for a DAS-6.

Average@Best
28-10-2009, 07:17 PM
just wondering if this is an orbital polisher and is it anygood?


http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Clearance/Power+Tools/Pro+180mm+Sander+Polisher+230v/d50/sd3150/p35104

also what is a good price for a Kestrel DAS-6 and what selection of pads would be the best for a newbie, its a bit mind boggling with all the choice

Good price @ £40 they sell from about £64 on the bay, but i had read the LCD speed control is a weak point of this machine, a jog dial give better speed control 1/4 1/2 3/4 of a speed point plus the actual buttons and LCD readout have been reported as weak as well.

Webmonkeyuk
28-10-2009, 08:21 PM
No, that's a rotary :thumb:

Look at paying about £70-80 ish for a DAS-6.

rotary's are harder to use right?

VIPER
29-10-2009, 01:21 PM
rotary's are harder to use right?

General rule of thumb yes, but there will naturally be people who take to a rotary better than a DA.

KEVLO
30-10-2009, 10:53 PM
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1255715617826&isSearch=true

Is this definately a DA not a rotary?

Paintguy
30-10-2009, 11:17 PM
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1255715617826&isSearch=true

Is this definately a DA not a rotary?
Technically it's a random orbit sander, but yes, it's the kind of thing that's referred to around here as a DA. Definitely not a rotary :)

VIPER
31-10-2009, 12:37 AM
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1255715617826&isSearch=true

Is this definately a DA not a rotary?

Yes, it has an random orbiting, non direct drive action and so in that respect it's what's referred to as a DA, although as said above, technically it's a sander. But then so was the Porter Cable and the likes of the G220 and Kestrel DAS-6 only evolved from that - they all share the same way of working ;)

Paintguy
31-10-2009, 11:56 PM
But then so was the Porter Cable and the likes of the G220 and Kestrel DAS-6 only evolved from that - they all share the same way of working ;)
All of which are really random orbit machines - not true DA's ;)

Yes I know I'm on a one-man semantic quest, but the term DA was originally introduced to describe machines with a locking counterweight mechanism, that enabled them to perform both random orbital and rotary actions. However the years/decades have blurred the lines between the two, and most people call a simple RO machine a DA :)

VIPER
31-10-2009, 11:59 PM
^^^ Yeah, I know ;)

Paintguy
01-11-2009, 12:15 AM
I guessed you would, but it might help those that are new to the subject (or more likely add to the confusion, lol) :D

KEVLO
01-11-2009, 12:25 AM
thanks for clearing it up guys.


so as a first step into the machine polishing world its a good choice? until i can afford a g220?

VIPER
01-11-2009, 05:47 PM
thanks for clearing it up guys.


so as a first step into the machine polishing world its a good choice? until i can afford a g220?

Well I think so yes, as there's a bit of difference between £25-30 and £120+ or however much a G220 is these days. You can master the techniques and practice with the polishes before making a commitment to spend that kind of money. Plus you can always sell the 'practice' machine on here :thumb:

With the more expensive 'alternative' machines, like the one I have (Clarke CROS-2; as seen below with a Menzerna 'Orange' polishing pad attached), they are now priced too close to a Kestrel DAS-6 to make them a wise buy these days and if you were spending £60 you might as well spend £20 more and get a Kestrel. But when there's about a hundred quid difference then yes I think they're a worthy learning tool, and you can get some really great results that you'd struggle to get or never get by hand.

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc250/red600ms/ClarkeMenz.jpg

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc250/red600ms/ClarkeMenz2.jpg

(* Note, this machine doesn't come with that ^^ much cable; it's only about 6/7 ft out of the box, but I replaced the lead on mine with a 25ft one :D)

mark_mcd
09-11-2009, 04:57 PM
Hi,

I had my first go with my MacAllister sander and Menzerna pads. I used the orange pad with some Autoglym SRP. Put the polish on with the machine on slowest setting for a couple of passes then put the speed up to around speed 5 or 6 to work in. I then used a lint free cloth to buff it off.

Bonnet went well and so did the first of the front wings. However I only got half way through the second wing and the pad literally came off at the backing (with the velcro still on the machine)?! Why has this happened?

Initial results look good to me but maybe I have been doing something very wrong? No damage to paint etc.

Thanks.

big ben
09-11-2009, 06:44 PM
i brought a new mac from B&Q a while back, its been brilliant... :buffer:

i use chemical guys 6.5" hex pads, they are also a good bit of kit. i also start on speed 2, then up to speed 5/6, never had a problem with the pad coming off???

i would recommend the mac and chemical guys pads to anyone who is new to machine polishing. Cheap and the correction from one pass with the light cut white pad and menz polish was amazing :thumb:

VIPER
09-11-2009, 08:28 PM
Hi,

I had my first go with my MacAllister sander and Menzerna pads. I used the orange pad with some Autoglym SRP. Put the polish on with the machine on slowest setting for a couple of passes then put the speed up to around speed 5 or 6 to work in. I then used a lint free cloth to buff it off.

Bonnet went well and so did the first of the front wings. However I only got half way through the second wing and the pad literally came off at the backing (with the velcro still on the machine)?! Why has this happened?

Initial results look good to me but maybe I have been doing something very wrong? No damage to paint etc.

Thanks.

With the vibration factor being so much higher with random orbit machines than it is for a rotary (can't be helped, it's just the way they work), there can be a tendancy for the cell structure of the foam to breakdown due to these high freqency vibrations. They do tend to fail at their weakest point, which is just below the glue bond to the felt part, but not part way through the initial use. I've had pads gradually come apart from the felt over the course of a few uses. They usually start to split at the edge and work their way towards the centre, and there obviously comes a point where it's going to come away totally, but I've never had one do it on the first go. Might be worth speaking to the place you bought it as it could be a bad batch perhaps?

mark_mcd
09-11-2009, 10:08 PM
i brought a new mac from B&Q a while back, its been brilliant... :buffer:

i use chemical guys 6.5" hex pads, they are also a good bit of kit. i also start on speed 2, then up to speed 5/6, never had a problem with the pad coming off???

i would recommend the mac and chemical guys pads to anyone who is new to machine polishing. Cheap and the correction from one pass with the light cut white pad and menz polish was amazing :thumb:

Thanks for the replys.

Ben, that's exactly the speed technique I was using... Loved the machine otherwise - really easy to hold and operate.

Viper - pad has literally ripped clean off the rear of the velcro (leaving velcro and thin layer of pad left on the machine!). Should I be soaking the pads or anything before their initial use? I literally got the bonnet and one wing done as said previous. Have ordered 2 of the same pad again - if it's being suggested that it might be a faulty pad I might give them a phone?

How much vibration should be occuring here - there did seem to be quite a bit especially once the speed was ramped up. Is there any way to cut it down at all?

Thanks again.

VIPER
10-11-2009, 10:40 AM
You can pre-wash them before the intial use and this will soften them up a little, but it's by no means a necessary step and I don't think it would aid in preventing the foam shearing off the felt.

The vibrations I talked about that adversely affect the pad's cell structure over time are very high frequency and not really something that will cause you discomfort in the same way that say using a hammer drill for hours on end would. I've used a DA/Random Orbit machine for almost a full day sometimes and not had any bad reactions in my hands. I dare say that if you were using one every day it might be different, and also I used to work in the building trade and so exposure to heavy industrial power tools might have built me some immunity to the comparatively very light vibrations caused by a machine polisher, I don't know?

As for how much vibration should you be experiencing in use? Hard to say really, but a lot of it should be 'damped' out by the pressure you're applying against the panel. If you're barely pressing down then the pad will spin faster, vibrate more and transfer more vibrations through the body of the machine and into your hands, not to mention not polishing properly. You should apply sufficient pressure to maintain the pad rotation speed at about 1-2 revolutions per second (more easily determined by marking the plate with a black line, as I think you can see on my 2nd picture on the previous page). Broadly speaking this should be approximately the correct pressure to polish with and as said, damp out some of the vibration.

mark_mcd
13-11-2009, 04:31 PM
Update: It's still eating pads :(

To me it seems that the base of the unit (where the pad velcros to) is cutting into the pad. By that I mean if you stick the pad to the unit, the slight overlap of the unit base past the velcro backing of the pad is digging into the foam. This cut is then working deeper into the pad throughout use, and seems to travel slowly under the velcro backing too. Since the pad and machine should be moving at the same rate however (they are stuck to each other), I cannot understand why this is happening i.e. where the 'cut' is coming from.

I did the roof today, and it's looking great, but the pad is ruined already! Maybe a slightly bigger pad with larger velcro attachment might help matters?
:wall:

mark_mcd
13-11-2009, 06:17 PM
Here are some images of the pads http://img267.imageshack.us/g/p1010088t.jpg/

Any help appreciated :)

maersk
14-11-2009, 09:14 PM
That is a menz pad if i'm not mistaken and mine do that too but only after doing a Transit van from pink to gloss red...........................................over three days!

Stevolution
16-11-2009, 07:59 PM
Well I think so yes, as there's a bit of difference between £25-30 and £120+ or however much a G220 is these days. You can master the techniques and practice with the polishes before making a commitment to spend that kind of money. Plus you can always sell the 'practice' machine on here :thumb:

With the more expensive 'alternative' machines, like the one I have (Clarke CROS-2; as seen below with a Menzerna 'Orange' polishing pad attached), they are now priced too close to a Kestrel DAS-6 to make them a wise buy these days and if you were spending £60 you might as well spend £20 more and get a Kestrel. But when there's about a hundred quid difference then yes I think they're a worthy learning tool, and you can get some really great results that you'd struggle to get or never get by hand.

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc250/red600ms/ClarkeMenz.jpg

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc250/red600ms/ClarkeMenz2.jpg

(* Note, this machine doesn't come with that ^^ much cable; it's only about 6/7 ft out of the box, but I replaced the lead on mine with a 25ft one :D)

Just a quick one regarding this clarke sander, the ol' man has one of these (only used once so think its worth a borrow ;) )
What pads would you say work best on this sander and what speeds do you use. Im guessing this is a max 2-3 clicks on the speed control as well as trigger control going off the instructions.
Im looking at some light to medium swirl removal on a silver fabia possibly caused by jet wash/auto car wash brushes. Also whats a good compound/swirl remover to use with this machine (im a complete novice machine wise so dont want anything over the top.)
Thanks :)

VIPER
16-11-2009, 08:11 PM
Ideally you need to remove the oiled felt & plastic ring from behind the backing plate (I did a pictorial guide to this on here somewhere, but it's only a case of 4 screws to remove the backing plate and this ring can be put back afterwards).

The only issue with you is, that you're borrowing it, and I'm assuming your old fella wants it back unmolested? Now my one you see there ^^ has its backing plate cut down to 130mm because as standard it's 150mm and therefore negates the use of the smaller diameter pads that I'd normally suggest for these 'alternative' machine (which normally have a 125mm backing plate), and that's the orange and yellow Menzerna (orange seen in the pic).

Leaving it at the 150mm size, you're up into the 165mm + sized pads and tbh. it can struggle with these to maintain spin speed under load; not down to power (it's 750w) but more with the counterweight arrangement.

So unless you can adapt it as I've done with mine, it's probably not worth you even borrowing it, mate - sorry.

If you can 'butcher it' for your own needs then go with the 2 pads I've suggested (or the Gloss Evolution ones from Polished Bliss at their 145mm size would be a good alternative). And with this, for ease of use either go for Menzerna 203S if you only want to buy one polish, or for a bigger range of correction ability go for the PO85RD 3.02 Power Finish (formally 'Intensive Polish'), and PO85RE Final Finish as a 'twin' polish set up.

Stevolution
16-11-2009, 08:59 PM
Well seeing as its only been used once, its going to be long term borrow and if worst comes to it, i can get him another one but he likes his detail sander better and uses that every so often for his lil DIY jobs, so modding it wont be a prob ;)

So in a nutshell, mod down the backing plate to 130mm for use with 125mm pads and use the mezerna pads.
Would the S203 be good enuff to erase most the swirl with this machine? I intend to use my dodo SN as a final finishing / protective coat.

VIPER
17-11-2009, 08:02 PM
Cut down the backing plate right up to the hard plastic top part (takes it to just under 130mm. Menz pads are 135mm btw. not 125mm, and the Gloss It Evo ones are 145mm). It's only super density 'foam' so cuts with a long sharp craft knife. Pads should always be bigger than the backing plate, even it's only just.

You can order another full size 150mm backing plate direct from Clarke if your Dad wants one. I priced them up and posted on this thread way back with the info; I think they were about 5 or 6 quid something like that. I keep meaning to get one to cut down really small so I can use spot pads.

Impossible to say 'blind' if 203S will do the job, but on the orange pad it will have reasonable swirl removal ability, but a twin set up of the 2 I mentioned before would give you a wider scope for what you can achieve.

dim
19-11-2009, 03:26 PM
nice looking alternatives

naeemm
25-11-2009, 03:13 PM
hi guys. im new to machine polishing but have been referred to Viper fby some fellow members on zroadster.

i need a good polisher....ive heard random orbital are the safest and so have been trying to find one priced between £30- £60....ive seen the silverline ones you guys have mentioned on here but i think they are rotary ones.

can someone please just direct me to the right
- polisher
- pads
- polish

so i can put them all in a basket and pay for them.

Your help would be much appreciated

cheers

naeemm
25-11-2009, 04:24 PM
i was thinking of getting this Mac as mentioned in the posts here
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&t

can someone please tell direct me to the pads i would need to use SRP. i just have light swirls on my Z3. being a BMW it has hard paint so just need the right stuff to get the job done

thanks again

VIPER
25-11-2009, 05:28 PM
i was thinking of getting this Mac as mentioned in the posts here
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=20&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=macallister&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&t

can someone please tell direct me to the pads i would need to use SRP. i just have light swirls on my Z3. being a BMW it has hard paint so just need the right stuff to get the job done

thanks again

Good choice of machine :thumb: And with that I would recommend either Menzerna 135mm pads (the orange for polishing - which I think you'd need on your car's paint rather than the softer yellow finishing one). The other alternative pads would be the Gloss It Evolution pads which are slightly larger at 145mm (probably the yellow light cut for you from that range). Both of these are good because they aren't too large and suit these machines better than the regular sized 165mm+ sized ones.

Unfortunately I no longer direct to any of our traders given my position on this site, for obvious reasons. Hopefully someone else will know the trader who stocks both of these types of pads and can advise you.

If you did decide to got for a dedicated machine polish rather than the SRP, then the Menzerna PO85RD 3.02 Power Finish on either of those 2 pads should give great results, followed by Menzerna PO85RE Final Finish to refine and sharpen the finish. If you only wanted to buy one polish and do it in one step rather than a correction > refining approach, then Menerna's 203S is sort of half way house between the aforementioned two, but obviously has less cutting ability. Without seeing the severity of the swirls you're trying to correct, it's impossible to determine which of the two options I've suggested here is best for you.

iainh
10-01-2010, 08:50 PM
Just want to say thanks to all who have contributed on this. A DA was way down my list of things to get (having only read about detailing and not actually done any yet!)

Anyway, the sander I had was a MAC so just placed an order for the pads and polish

CHEERS GUYS - really really appreciated! :thumb:

grayfox
11-01-2010, 06:23 PM
would someone kindly direct me to a correct backing plate for the mentioned mac DA for use with the spot CG Hex pads? ta

spanerman
11-01-2010, 06:27 PM
The mac wont accept a conventional backing plate...

Sam.

grayfox
11-01-2010, 06:38 PM
oh thats a shame, so you can only buy 135mm pads to work with it? good thing I haven't brought any other pads yet

mellowfellow
11-01-2010, 08:30 PM
just use the smaller plate you got with machine ! you got 2 plates with mac didnt you ?

VIPER
11-01-2010, 10:38 PM
oh thats a shame, so you can only buy 135mm pads to work with it? good thing I haven't brought any other pads yet

Or the 'Gloss It' pads at 145mm would be fine. Or you could just cut down any pad, in theory, to suit.

spanerman
11-01-2010, 10:41 PM
just use the smaller plate you got with machine ! you got 2 plates with mac didnt you ?

The newer shape mac only comes with one backing plate.

Sam.

grayfox
12-01-2010, 12:44 AM
^^ yup just got the one

mike_306
25-01-2010, 10:51 PM
I've got the newer MAC sander (which has been great so far) and am thinking of tackling some moderate swirling on a modern audi soon. I've only got the finishing and polishing menz pads, do you reckon that will be enough in paired with some 105? Or will I need the white compounding pad, I'm not sure if the polishing pad will be able to touch the hard paint!

Doc
05-02-2010, 04:16 PM
The conclusion on my Orange Silverline is that it is broken, like others I have seen on here.
It is only good for applying LSP as it simply doesnt spin enough to work any polish.

I have borrowed a Silverline Sander/Polisher from work that is a rotary so wish me luck!

rossmuir1978
09-02-2010, 07:18 PM
just reserved my macallister.

i also have some major swirl marks on a black a3 s line 2007 model - any recomendations on pads and polish ?

cheers-the detailing virgin !!!

ross

theshrew
10-02-2010, 09:43 AM
Ive not looked at this thread for a long time now but thought id say i was in B&Q at weekend and they seem to have the Macalister in stock again and it had a NEW sticker on it so presume its slightly different but still cheap :thumb:

Ptar64
10-02-2010, 03:22 PM
Just wondering if this is any good to use?

http://www.paints4u.com/ProductDetails.aspx?productID=6609

Found it while looking for some paint for my car. I have VAG Paint so what would be recommended to use to get good results? Going to get a scrap panel hopefully at the weekend ready for some practise.

VIPER
10-02-2010, 04:01 PM
Just wondering if this is any good to use?

http://www.paints4u.com/ProductDetails.aspx?productID=6609

Found it while looking for some paint for my car. I have VAG Paint so what would be recommended to use to get good results? Going to get a scrap panel hopefully at the weekend ready for some practise.

That's a rotary mate, not a random orbit. You can get a Silverline rotary for less than that from a few of our traders if you wanted to go down that route :thumb:

Ptar64
10-02-2010, 04:45 PM
That's a rotary mate, not a random orbit. You can get a Silverline rotary for less than that from a few of our traders if you wanted to go down that route :thumb:

Thanks for that Viper :thumb: I would like to start machine polishing, currently got a Seat Leon, which has the VAG paint (Black Magic).
Would it be worth me getting a DAS6 and learning that way to get results?
Or since its harder paint to go with a Rotary and get alot of practice then use that on my car?

VIPER
10-02-2010, 07:10 PM
Not easy to answer really as just because it's harder paint doesn't necessarily equate that a DA will struggle and a rotary will make light work of it as the pad and polish combos will play a huge part in the finished result - not to mention good technique in the case of both machines.

I can't really say which way to go tbh. You'll get rotary fans saying go straight in with them after reading guides and getting practice, or even getting some personal tuition. Then there are the DA fans who will say that a rotary in inexperienced hands can be a tricky tool to master, and that given the right pad/polish and some patience you can achieve equally good results in a safer way.

I'd advise reading Dave KG's guides for both the rotary and the DA and from those, you might get an indication of which is likely to suit you better (they're well worth reading anyway, even if you make up your mind which type of machine to get beforehand).

:thumb:

Ptar64
10-02-2010, 10:27 PM
Viper, Thank you very much for your very clear response :thumb:
I shall have a read of Daves guides and decide which I think will be best for me.

Then I will get shopping shortly after :buffer:.

Danno1975
05-03-2010, 01:18 AM
So after using my Silverline rather a lot now I am thinking of getting a slightly better DA, I've been looking at the DAS-6 Random Orbit polisher for £79.95 on cyc

Specifications:

•Orbit Size: 8mm
•Backing Plate Thread Size: 5/16" (same as Porter Cable, G220 and UDM's)
•Variable 6 Speed Dial: 2,500 to 6,500rpm
•Removable side handle (left or right side of machine)
•Weight - 2.3kg (approx)
•Supplied with two Velcro Backing Plates Size: 125mm ( 5” ) and 150mm (6")
•Fits 5", 6" and 6.5" polsihing pads
Key Features:

•CE marked / 240v with UK plug
•3.1 Meter Heavy Duty Cable
•D-Handle and Side Handle
•Canvas Carry Case
•Aluminium Gear Housing Cover
•CNC Finished Gears
•Electricity Feedback Circuit
•1 Year UK Manufacturer Warranty

Will it be much better than the Silver line and it is worth the money?, got some mates cars to polish up this summer :)

Thanks

tshirt2k
10-03-2010, 02:16 PM
Hi, Been on here never posted before.

Found this sander in wickes. Anyone had experience with it? Bit more power than the macallister and £5 cheaper.

http://www.wickes.co.uk/content/ebiz/wickes/invt/186873/480W-Random-Orbit-Sander_medium.jpg


480W Random Orbit Sander
Hook and loop base pad means easy sheet change. Also has dust extraction facility and variable speed control.



Hook and loop base pad for easy sheet change
Dust extraction facility
Variable speed control
Supplied with 10 assorted sanding discs, hexagon key and dust collection bag
Sheet size 125mm
Orbit diameter 2.5mm
No load speed 5000-12000rpm
Weight 2.6kg

Danno1975
19-03-2010, 12:10 AM
Hi, Been on here never posted before.

Found this sander in wickes. Anyone had experience with it? Bit more power than the macallister and £5 cheaper.

http://www.wickes.co.uk/content/ebiz/wickes/invt/186873/480W-Random-Orbit-Sander_medium.jpg


480W Random Orbit Sander
Hook and loop base pad means easy sheet change. Also has dust extraction facility and variable speed control.



Hook and loop base pad for easy sheet change
Dust extraction facility
Variable speed control
Supplied with 10 assorted sanding discs, hexagon key and dust collection bag
Sheet size 125mm
Orbit diameter 2.5mm
No load speed 5000-12000rpm
Weight 2.6kg

I've seen that looks ok to me:thumb:

bretttf
19-03-2010, 10:09 AM
I've got the Mac from B & Q.
I have just ordered a couple of the Menz Orange and Yellow pads and the 4 bottle sample kit of Menz polish from CYC.

Which polish would be best suited for giving the headlights a buff up?
I'm guessing the fine/final finish and Yellow pad?

Great info too guys and thanks to everyone & Viper.

Danno1975
19-03-2010, 10:55 AM
I've got the Mac from B & Q.
I have just ordered a couple of the Menz Orange and Yellow pads and the 4 bottle sample kit of Menz polish from CYC.

Which polish would be best suited for giving the headlights a buff up?
I'm guessing the fine/final finish and Yellow pad?

Great info too guys and thanks to everyone & Viper.

Yep good on gloss plastic trim too.

VIPER
19-03-2010, 11:56 AM
@ shirt2k: Specs seem pretty much in line with the old orange Silverline, but the orbit seems small at 2.5mm - you sure that's correct? The Silverline's I'm sure was about 5mm (long time since I've used it tbh.).

2.5mm would take an age to break down polishes, although it would be okay for applying glazes and paint cleansers etc. on a finishing pad.

jayval
25-03-2010, 03:16 AM
Yes, it will be fine - I only use mine on speeds 1-3 (which should roughly keep it within the speed range of a G220) and under load on the panel it behaves just like other detailing machines. I've even used it on my XR2 which has quite soft paint and it worked fine.

Just had a look at your xr2 stunning brings back memorys although mines was silver

mr.valver
25-03-2010, 05:41 PM
Just bought a Silverline (old orange one) with 125mm backing.

Whats the best pads to get and is it possible to change the backing plate for a 80mm one for using spot pads?

tshirt2k
13-04-2010, 02:12 PM
@ shirt2k: Specs seem pretty much in line with the old orange Silverline, but the orbit seems small at 2.5mm - you sure that's correct? The Silverline's I'm sure was about 5mm (long time since I've used it tbh.).

2.5mm would take an age to break down polishes, although it would be okay for applying glazes and paint cleansers etc. on a finishing pad.

Thats what it says on the website.. How does that compare to the Mac? Want to have a go at using one of these to improve the paint on my golf.

Reflectology
13-04-2010, 08:32 PM
if you have a compressor you need one of these http://catalogue.3m.eu/en_gb/gb-aad/Machines/Air_Powered_Random_Orbital_Sanders

mysticbertie
16-04-2010, 04:39 PM
if i buy the mac (£35) or performance power (£20) from B&Q will it come with a velcro backing plate so i would just need to buy 2 x 135mm pads (menz orange and yellow).

how does the 2 of these compare, i dont want to buy the cheap one and find it harder to work with when i may be using it for a good few hours i dont want a machine that makes it more labour intensive.

i have a 1995 bmw 5 series i want to shine and remove scratches and swirls from. what polishes should i get and as its an old car would a polish be better that has a filling action too? I would prefer good budget brands rather than best of the best stuff as im not working just now so money is tight. :buffer:

do i just need a medium cut polish and a finishing polish ? Do i then need a sealant and wax or is there one product does both?

VIPER
23-04-2010, 01:35 PM
I'd advise the Mac from those 2 personally.

Yes it comes with a 125mm velcro backing plate attached so you just need the pads (Menzerna orange polishing and yellow finishing 135mm ones are ideal).

If you're just doing your own car then have a look at some of our traders' samples - they nearly all do Menzerna and Meguiars ones, and a 100ml (even a 50ml) bottle will be enough to do a full car. If you're planning on doing others afterwards then have a look at the Menerna 250ml kit.

You don't need a sealant and a wax, you can just use either, but if you are then apply them sealant first then wax over the top. I'd go one or the other myself.

:thumb:

mysticbertie
26-04-2010, 12:43 PM
I'd advise the Mac from those 2 personally.

Yes it comes with a 125mm velcro backing plate attached so you just need the pads (Menzerna orange polishing and yellow finishing 135mm ones are ideal).

If you're just doing your own car then have a look at some of our traders' samples - they nearly all do Menzerna and Meguiars ones, and a 100ml (even a 50ml) bottle will be enough to do a full car. If you're planning on doing others afterwards then have a look at the Menerna 250ml kit.

You don't need a sealant and a wax, you can just use either, but if you are then apply them sealant first then wax over the top. I'd go one or the other myself.

:thumb:

thanks mate i bought the mac in the nd and menz pads however the menz pads are useless on the DA and i have since read a lot about them not lasting on a DA so i read the hexlogic pads are better so im ordering them today. The menz pads just crumbled after a while and i only got my bonnet, wing and door done. The mac is a good bit of kit though :thumb:

adseybear
05-05-2010, 08:05 PM
Is it possible to fit a smaller than 135mm pad to the Mac.

Like a 4" spot pad?

mysticbertie
05-05-2010, 08:12 PM
Is it possible to fit a smaller than 135mm pad to the Mac.

Like a 4" spot pad?

i read the older mac had a spare backing plate and some people machined it to suit the smaller pads.

you could still attch a 140 pad but you risk damaging the paint with the exposed areas of the plate

SP36
06-05-2010, 09:52 AM
Hi,

This is my first post so please forgive some of my lack of understanding.
I have been following this post closely over the last 6 weeks or so and finally decided to buy myself a Mac. I now need pads and I notice Menzerna pads seem to be popular with the Mac. However I am concerned with the fact that they seem to come a part after a few panels. So I'm thinking of going for the Chemical Guys Hex Logic Pads but I don't know which colour... Black or White or another?

I have a Performance Blue Mondeo ST TDCI with a few swirl marks and light scratches. As far I can gather its best to start low and work your way up in terms of the cut of the polish and pads. Is that correct? If so I currently use Autoglym SRP or UDS and have both in stock so that's the polish I'm going to start with (though I realise they have very little cut). What Hex Logic pad can anyone recommend I start with?

Thanks for any replys in advance!

mysticbertie
06-05-2010, 10:03 AM
Hi,

This is my first post so please forgive some of my lack of understanding.
I have been following this post closely over the last 6 weeks or so and finally decided to buy myself a Mac. I now need pads and I notice Menzerna pads seem to be popular with the Mac. However I am concerned with the fact that they seem to come a part after a few panels. So I'm thinking of going for the Chemical Guys Hex Logic Pads but I don't know which colour... Black or White or another?

I have a Performance Blue Mondeo ST TDCI with a few swirl marks and light scratches. As far I can gather its best to start low and work your way up in terms of the cut of the polish and pads. Is that correct? If so I currently use Autoglym SRP or UDS and have both in stock so that's the polish I'm going to start with (though I realise they have very little cut). What Hex Logic pad can anyone recommend I start with?

Thanks for any replys in advance!

yes the menz pads dont last, best not to buy them, i bought the hexlogics as after more research they seem to be the best option, from what i read many times i ended up buying yellow white and black, i have not had time to try them yet.

champ222
18-05-2010, 05:04 PM
just found this thread... 182 pages!! lol

i read through the first 12 pages or so, and the orange silverline seemed the polisher of choice, that doesnt seem to be the case over the last few pages, is it not available now?

So what is currently the prefered budget random orbital?

i already have some Zaino Z-PC fusion, so any pad reccomendations for that would be useful too.

Thanks in advance

Andy

wylie coyote
20-05-2010, 09:32 PM
Looking to buy the Mac this weekend - is this still recommended as the budget DA choice? Anyone who's bought one recently got any feedback?

Cheers:thumb:

Ricko78
20-05-2010, 09:50 PM
I was looking at the Mac a couple of weeks ago on the back of this thread. However, when I went to look at it and picked it up, personally it struck me as quite heavy, large, and cumbersome. Didn't feel great to me so spent an extra £40 and bought a DAS-6. Not saying its a bad machine (because i've never used it to comment) but maybe have a look and feel beforehand if anyone was thinking of ordering online blind.

champ222
21-05-2010, 10:50 AM
good to know, is this the newer mac one they sell in b&q currently for £35 ish? as there was an older mac model that looks larger in the pictures at least...

did you feel the DAS-6 was much lighter when you got it?

Ricko78
21-05-2010, 11:57 AM
Yeah it was the latest one, £35ish as you say. I would say that the DAS-6 felt lighter and it is far less cumbersome IMO. I also read on here that the way the Mac is designed would also suggest that you may not be able to get into more tricky areas (i.e. under the wing mirrors) and when you look at it you'll see why.

At the end of the day it is half the price + more of a DAS-6 and therefore you do have to bear this in mind. Personally though I’m glad I spent the extra and bought a dedicated machine rather than trying to save the money on the Mac and then always wishing I just spent the extra £40 for a better machine.

Maybe someone on here who has actually used both can give a more detailed response.

champ222
21-05-2010, 01:25 PM
ok mate, good info there, thanks a lot.

i'll have a think!

where did you get your DAS-6 from?

Ricko78
21-05-2010, 01:27 PM
I got mine from here:

http://www.autopaint-pro.co.uk/kestral-das-6-dual-action-sanderpolisher-655-p.asp

Ordered it one day and I think it came the next (or certainly the day after).

Yoghurtman
21-05-2010, 01:58 PM
Looking to buy the Mac this weekend - is this still recommended as the budget DA choice? Anyone who's bought one recently got any feedback?

Cheers:thumb:

Mac works great for me, on my own cars.
used it maybe 3-4 times now and get good results using Menz polishes.

My cars are in pretty good condition anyway, but recently switched to Dodo Lime Prime, again with great results.

Had some water spots on the roof of my car last weekend, so broke out the Mac and LP and sorted it all out in under 30 mins.

Go for it! :thumb:

champ222
21-05-2010, 04:12 PM
how is it for doing smaller areas?

Lee.GTi180
21-05-2010, 09:58 PM
I apologise for my ignorance before I even begin writing my post lol All I want to do is remove abit of swirling from my car, the mrs's and maybe the parents if they ask nicely! So what's my best course of action (on a student's budget :() Could you please give me links to the machine, pads (for swirl removal and buffing) and the polish's I would need? Thanks alot in advance, it's very much appreciated!

maersk
22-05-2010, 04:00 PM
Erm, its all in here.................

Kempy
24-05-2010, 01:40 AM
I've read as much of this thread as possible and will probably buy a mac this week from B&Q, will it get swirls out? I was looking at using farecla G10 compound, will the mac be any good on this polish? otherwise I'll stick to SRP

ThcKid
25-05-2010, 12:35 AM
I've read as much of this thread as possible and will probably buy a mac this week from B&Q, will it get swirls out? I was looking at using farecla G10 compound, will the mac be any good on this polish? otherwise I'll stick to SRP

Mac is pretty good at minor correction, i'm a newbie to the DA and i think it is a confidence inspiring machine that gets much better results than you would get by hand!

Here is my first attempt with MAC and Swirl-x :D

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=165081

Kempy
25-05-2010, 12:54 AM
I think its worth it. Polishing by hand is a waste of time lol. Is it quite slow progress with the small pads?

VIPER
26-05-2010, 01:37 PM
Hard yes, but I wouldn't say it's a waste of time though. I had a Mini come to me over the weekend, black one as well which had been previously buzzed over with a rotary by some clown and left horrendous swirling. Now my neighbours were having a family BBQ and so I couldn't use the machine due to the noise, and had to polish by hand. Remember - black car and how hot it was at the weekend. Now of course I didn't get full correction, it was more an 'enhancement' but I still got great results by hand with Zaino dual sided foam applicators, Menz 3.02 and 203s and a lot of sweat :thumb:

Not ideal by any stretch, but considering the circumstances, when hand polishing is all that's available, it can give dramatic improvements, so not always a waste of time, it's just really, really hard work.

wylie coyote
26-05-2010, 02:19 PM
I'm torn between getting a DAS6 or the Mac - had a look at the Mac in B&Q and it seemed quite heavy like a previous poster has said. Is there much difference or do I need to eat more spinach?:D

Anyone who's used the two able to comment?:thumb:

VIPER
26-05-2010, 04:16 PM
Not used both myself, but I don't think you'll really notice much difference when actually in use in all honesty.

Where I think you need to make the distinction is if you're just doing your own/partners car etc. and the defects you plan on removing aren't that bad - just light/medium swirling and so on, then the Mac will probably be more than enough for your needs.

But if you think there's a chance you'll want to start doing mates' and neighbours' cars and will then be faced with varying degrees of paint defect removal challenges, then the slightly faster working times and more capable performance of a dedicated detailing machine, that facilites a wider range of pad options and has a larger lateral offest to the action would be in your best interests in my opinion.

wylie coyote
26-05-2010, 09:25 PM
Just going to be doing my own/family cars, none of which are heavily swirled. Thanks for your comments - I think the Mac is all I need. Even if it may be a bit heavier than some others, this won't be so important compared to the saved effort over hand application.:)

Cheers Viper:thumb:

VIPER
26-05-2010, 09:35 PM
You're welcome mate :thumb: On horizontal panels you won't notice it all because the machine will be resting on it's own weight anyway (plus a degree of downward pressure, depending on how much you need to apply to maintain a pad speed of at least 1 rev per second). On vertical panels then obviously you're holding the weight of the machine and then it might tell on you after a long spell. But in frankly I don't think there's sufficient difference between a Mac and a DAS-6 to have one giving you arm ache and one not.

One thing I've found though, is that machines like the Mac and others discussed on this thread, due to their smaller offset are less prone to any adverse vibration reactions in your hands. This has been the case for me anyway and although that slightly lesser vibrating effect increases polish breakdown times a tad, it's got a bonus of maybe not making your hands/arms tingle after prolonged use.

SP36
18-06-2010, 11:55 AM
So I got My Mac. I was advised to start low and move up with the cutting ability of the products I use. I got myself a Chem Guys Hex Logic Black pad and I had some Autoglym SRP and UDS I decided to start with that with no real results (I realise non of these have any cut). Just made applying the polish easier. It also went very dusty.

Think I'm going to move up to a Hex Logic pad White or Green pad and use Menz 203. Would you recommend practice of a scrap panel or would I be okay to go straight in there?

Danno1975
20-06-2010, 10:29 PM
Had to buy a mac from B&Q in the week as my main polisher busted whilst polishing a Black Mini Cooper S (a very special one I'll post up about soon), used it for enhancement.

Thought mac was really good and as my polisher is still waiting for bits I used the mac again this weekend on a range Rover for lime prime'ing and Diamond White application and really enjoyed using it.

Might sell it soon though as I have my old Silver line as a back up (for got to take it with me though when I needed it!!.

Kempy
23-06-2010, 12:38 AM
Went to B&Q to get a MAc but there was none left. Must be a bunch of people with the same idea lol. There was one on show, they weigh a fair bit, so I looked at the next priced item being a B&D one but this didnt have a adjustable speed on it. So I bought the cheapo one for £20 :) I doesnt have the same wattage as the MAc but using it today, it worked fine enough for me being a noob.

Anyway I used cheapo again orange compound pads from machine mart, work well. Not being able to say the difference between better ones tbh

I wanna buy new compounding pads, as these cheapo ones might come off the Velcro soon. From reading the forum, I see that certain pads might cut more, these might be better for me maybe as im down on power??

Will I get the most out of the more abrasive polishes with my budget orbital? I want to do my mothers polo but the swirls and stretches on it are unbelievably bad

thanks

Kempy
24-06-2010, 08:43 PM
anybody else bought the cheap orbital like me?

Danno1975
24-06-2010, 10:43 PM
Went to B&Q to get a MAc but there was none left. Must be a bunch of people with the same idea lol. There was one on show, they weigh a fair bit, so I looked at the next priced item being a B&D one but this didnt have a adjustable speed on it. So I bought the cheapo one for £20 :) I doesnt have the same wattage as the MAc but using it today, it worked fine enough for me being a noob.

Anyway I used cheapo again orange compound pads from machine mart, work well. Not being able to say the difference between better ones tbh

I wanna buy new compounding pads, as these cheapo ones might come off the Velcro soon. From reading the forum, I see that certain pads might cut more, these might be better for me maybe as im down on power??

Will I get the most out of the more abrasive polishes with my budget orbital? I want to do my mothers polo but the swirls and stretches on it are unbelievably bad

thanks


Chemical guys pads are great, I did this to a badly swirled Shogun on my mac using the white finishing pad and lime prime.

Before
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13320&d=1277391193
After
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13321&d=1277391203
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=13322&d=1277391212

PS, I have a Silver line and a Mac and the Mac is far better than the Silver line. I also have a DAS-6 pro which I threaded during a detail and had to replace it urgently with the mac from B&Q as i was 112 mile from home. Its great for glaze and cleaner wax and I find myself reaching for it instead of the DAS. It can clog around the rubber dust cover, but I am sure it will clean up ok (not with your finger mind, I have two nasty cuts from ill advised wiping (first time shame on you second time shame on me)

Kempy
24-06-2010, 11:25 PM
you got skills. would love to be able to correct the mess that my mum polo is in. gotta get some pads and lime prime it appears

Kempy
24-06-2010, 11:41 PM
how did it remove swirls? what does the lime prime do? From reading its not an abrasive

Simpson.
25-06-2010, 12:45 AM
Just got a Mac from B&Q :D

Simpson.
25-06-2010, 12:46 AM
how did it remove swirls? what does the lime prime do? From reading its not an abrasive

Its contains minor abbrasives

Danno1975
25-06-2010, 01:03 AM
how did it remove swirls? what does the lime prime do? From reading its not an abrasive

Lime prime is really just a cleaner wax, but it does have micro abrasives that on softer paint can correct swirls if used correctly.

Try it on the Polo on a polishing pad and work it really well:buffer:, might take a few hits but you'll get some nice results.

Few more shots here http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=2240224#post2240224

Danno1975
26-06-2010, 12:04 AM
Right, got my DAS-6 pro fixed but like using the Mac too so was using it to glaze today and it started bogging, with glaze on a finishing pad!!, seems to be really stiff now thought it might be polish between the backig plate and the rubber seal but its clean, is there a known issue or shall i just take it back.

vekma
11-07-2010, 04:32 PM
ive just got this from b+q no offers on was £39.98 is it a latest version

this is for a ford puma i have

gonna get some menz pads and polish fron cyc

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4136/4782556715_0c172516aa_b.jpg

AdamVTI
11-07-2010, 06:26 PM
i just got one of these, havnt got any pads yet tho! gonna be using lime prime for now, see how that goes.

i only paid 34.99 tho last week!

priceworth
19-09-2010, 08:19 PM
hi guys, i got one of those sanders and i was wondering if it's going to work somehow - http://service.blackanddecker.co.uk/Products/ProductDetailBDK.aspx?ProductID=1079 :newbie:

Kempy
19-09-2010, 08:47 PM
no I dont think that'll work, mainly due to you not being able to get pads that shape

priceworth
19-09-2010, 08:50 PM
better picture in there - http://www.ispesl.it/vibrationdatabase/documenti/leggiDettHAV.asp?lang=en&quale=1641&pag=44

It has a backing plate which is 150mm but now i tried it and it looks it's not really rotating, it does rotate but by the vibrations. What's actually the difference between the random orbital sanders and the oribital sanders?

priceworth
20-09-2010, 09:05 PM
look like the topic is quite old, i readed every single page and i dont know now which is the latest machine for most bangs per bucks :D

This - http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?isSearch=true&fh_search=0000005179565&x=19&y=13

This - PRO CLARKE RANDOM ORBITAL SANDER CROS2 +SANDING DISCS: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools

This - http://www.wickes.co.uk/480W-Random-Orbit-Sander/invt/186873

Or this http://www.screwfix.com/prods/70994/Power-Tools/Sanders/Titan-PGEX42BE-1-420W-Random-Orbit-Sander;jsessionid=RDZW4250XMMC0CSTHZOSFFQ?ts=09510

pauly87
20-09-2010, 09:35 PM
read through this thread, some great info but still abit confused. i'm looking at getting this:
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10637570&fh_view_size=10&fh_start_index=10&fh_eds=%3f&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB%2fcategories%3 c%7b9372015%7d%2fcategories%3c%7b9372047%7d%2fcate gories%3c%7b9372206%7d&fh_refview=lister&ts=1285010561473&isSearch=false

would i be better getting chemical guys hex pads or menz pads?
read about the menz pads falling apart.

going to get some menz polish aswel.

thanks in advance :thumb:

pete5570
20-09-2010, 09:56 PM
Some of these alternatives are running at 4000-12000. That seems a bit fast for even a DA.

peachey
22-09-2010, 12:10 AM
found this offer on at screwfix

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/70994/Power-Tools/Sanders/Titan-PGEX42BE-1-420W-Random-Orbit-Sander?cm_mmc=GoogleBase-_-Datafeed-_-Power%20Tools-_-Titan%20PGEX42BE.1%20420W%20Random%20Orbit%20Sande r

samion
11-05-2011, 02:06 AM
Sorry to revive an old thread, but thought it is relevant seeing as my recent headache about whether or not to buy a DA for SRPing my Audi ended up totally by accident with me bumping into one of these in my brother's garage:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-TRITON-TROS-125mm-Orbital-Sander-inc-Case-/200604812376?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item2eb4fa8458

In case the link dies it's a Triton Tros Random Orbital Sander 125mm with 250W and 5" velcro plate and speeds of 9000-12000. I switched it on and it moves in a random sort of way like the vids I've seen of a DA.

Now I'm quite a newbie and thought I was onto something amazing but then got pointed to this thread so I guess no kudos to me :o But I'm quite keen to try this thing out and report how it is here with pics if it will help others.

I just need some help though please!

I have SRP and I will be buying a wax of some sort. Don't know which yet. I also have some megs scratch-X for some mild scratches on my black Audi. I'm hoping to apply using this but I have some questions. If someone can help please I'd be delighted and will hopefully be in a position to be of some use to the forum with some before/after pics when I am confident enough:

1) I want cheap pads that will *maybe* be able to give some good cut (I know SRP isn't a cutter but I understand it has *some* cutting ability - if only to rounden the edges of the swirls...), especially for when I'm using scratch-X. What should I go for? I was looking at http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/polishing/menzerna-polishing-pads/menzerna-compounding-pad/prod_212.html but I don't know if it would be too aggressive. But maybe on a cheap thing like this it'd be ok? And should I be fitting bigger than 5"?

2) I'm worried that the speed is 9000-12000 but I have read on this thread that I should only be going at a speed of 2 !!!!!! But then there's OPM vs RPM which does my head in a bit. What if I press hardish to get it to turn twice per second as advised... will I be doing damage because the speed (of oscillations I'm guessing!?) is too high? Or as it's a cheap RO device is it unlikely I'll ever do damage unless I use it like an idiot for ages on one spot? Especially as it's only 250W?

Any help would be much appreciated because I'm totally new to machines (and even SRP and wax for that matter!)

Dingo2002
11-05-2011, 02:30 PM
OPM = oscillations per minute
RPM = Revolutions per minute

Kind of the same thing except OPM counts the number of oscillations and RPM counts the number of times the head rotates.

9000 is too high as a starting speed. Speed 2 on a Pro DA would be nearer 2500-3500 with the highest speed probably being around 7-8000

The cheap polishers in Halfords are no good for a different reason to the Random Orbital you found. The Halfords ones are low power and tend to bog down when pressure is applied.
Yours is low power but has a very fast oscillation which could dry the polish out too quick or heat up the paint quickly. At those speeds I suspect most of the polish will fly off anyway :p

SRP does have a little cut and on a compounding pad or polishing pad would assist in cutting back lacquer though no where near as quickly as a dedicated cutting polish. I've seen correction to a wet sanded porsche front bumper undertaken with a wool pad and just using water as a lubricant and the finish was impressive though then needed refining.

The Random Orbitals further back in the thread ran at a lower speed so could be used at their lowest setting to correct and probably do a fairly reasonable job.

samion
11-05-2011, 05:57 PM
Thank you for that.

But a pro DA would have three times the power.

I'm wondering if I press a bit and it slows a bit whether it will calm it down to being more comparable?

Even if it does remain at 9000opm, can I give it a safe go? i.e. if I maybe pass quite quickly so it doesn't burn the paint at all?

Dingo2002
11-05-2011, 10:28 PM
Thank you for that.

But a pro DA would have three times the power.

I'm wondering if I press a bit and it slows a bit whether it will calm it down to being more comparable?

Even if it does remain at 9000opm, can I give it a safe go? i.e. if I maybe pass quite quickly so it doesn't burn the paint at all?

I think your confusing power and speed. At those kind of speeds the abrasives in the polishes aren't going to break down at the correct pace and therefore won't work on the paint correctly. You may get the machine to slow down by applying sufficient pressure but I'm not sure you'd be able to keep it consistent enough to break down the polish properly.

I wouldn't recommend giving it a go but at the end of the day its your paintwork :p

If you do, make sure you let us know how you got on. :buffer:

VIPER
11-05-2011, 10:55 PM
The menzerna 'white' is a bit too firm for your needs I think. Try try the orange one which is still fairly firm as 'polishing' pads go, but will 'break in' in use and soften up. you can also 'break it in', by the day before you're going to use it, just wash it in the sink - you don't need anything other than water; simply get it soaked and massage it a bit. This softens up the cells of the foam structure and once dry again (which it will be by the following day), it will be softer than it was out of the packet. I've done this with a few Menz oranges I've used.

Pad does need to bigger than the backing plate though for obvious reasons.

9000 starting OPM is too high really, and very first machine that kicked off this thread had a starting OPM of 4000 if memory serves, which isn't a million miles away from say, a G220's 2760. The (usually) smaller offset of these machines does compensate to a degree for the higher speeds they run at. Providing under load (weight of the machine plus a bit) the pad rotates at least at 1 rev per second - more is better), then you'll be okay providing the other factors are sound (correct pad/product match up and the solidity of the paintwork you're polishing).

:thumb:

tarbyonline
13-05-2011, 02:24 AM
I came across one of the halfords DA sanders by accident today when getting some paint mixed. Only 20 quid so thought what the hell! As previously discussed its definitely a DA and the speeds arent indicated. However the trigger is pressure sensitive so you can slow it right down - the speed selector merely stops you depressing the trigger past a certain level.

Initial thoughts are its a lot quieter than expected and seems solidly built - certainly more solid than I expect a £20 power tool to be and I would say better build than the £30 performance power in B&Q atm (also think its lighter than the b&q). If anyone is interested it seems to be supplied to Halfords by a company called nu-tool.

Comes with a hard case (which has metal locking clasps!). Most interesting to me is that the backplate is removable and held on by a single screw. however there are 4 screws affixing the actual backplate itself 2 the mount attached to the sander which look to me to be spaced the same as those on the das6 backplate, so I may investigate this further.

Cant judge its actual polishing performance as I have no pads yet. Looks like Im going to go with Chemical Guys Hexlogic 5.5" pads once they come back to me with the best colours for my needs (its quite a range). I looked at menzerna pads but as it will be 2 Fiats with very soft paint (I know from experience) I will be polishing I thought the foam might be a bit hard. Looking towards 85RE polish as well.

Will update when I have some feedback!

EDIT: Its also labeled as excentric. Tried pressing it hard against some cardboard earlier on (no pad) on slowest setting and it threw it across the room so will be interesting to see if it stops orbiting like some other models seem to have

EDIT 2: Have ordered white and black hexlogic pads from car wash n wax, and menz 106FA and 85RD from CYC

tarbyonline
13-05-2011, 06:51 PM
Just in case anyone wondered (like me) how this things worked/looked inside, heres some (iphone) pics. This is of the Halfords one but I would imagine they are all pretty similar.

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0161.JPG

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0162.JPG

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0163.JPG

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0164.JPG

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0165.JPG
The random orbit bit!

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0166.JPG

http://pictures.tarbyonline.com/IMG_0167.JPG
Closeup of the speed selector on this model which basically just limits how far you can depress the trigger.

kgh1977
18-05-2011, 09:27 PM
Hi all,

went to the local B&Q and the mac random orbital sander are no longer on offer....I'm gutted to say the least!

silky
19-05-2011, 10:48 PM
i have the b&q performance one with hex 5.5" pads and having had some practice goes etc, finally took on a scratch on the roof of my car and on the bonnet using the orange hex pad and some farecla G3 from halfords.. to be honest i wasnt expecting much but its took i would say about 90% of the scratches out in total, can only really see them at certain angles

will be going for a proper one shortly as it can be quite awkward at times to use but it does the job

BrAtKo
19-05-2011, 11:40 PM
Hello there I'm newbie and I'd like to ask you about practical experiences with Silverline Silverstorm 125563 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Silverline-Silverstorm%C2%AE-125563-Random-Sander/dp/B0021L95VG) (blue one) ? Is it worth of that money or it is much better to earn money for Kestrel DAS6 ? I think I will not use it very often to polish with (I think up to 4 times per year). Thank you.

Furkin
09-07-2011, 04:39 PM
I'm thinking of taking the plunge & trying one or other of these machines.
It's taken hours to read this thread alone, & I'm still not sure which (entry level) machines are coming out on top of recommendations and what are the basic pads to start with.

I see mention of the hardness of paint/lacquer etc, which has a bearing.
I have a MB E220 CDI (211). How do I know how hard the paint is, or is there a table of paint hardnesses ?

To save me reading all this again - bearing in mind that opinions & machines might have changed since the OP - whichever machine I buy, what is the ‘starter’ pack that I need to buy - pads, polishes, compounds etc and which machine is currently favourable ?

Cheers all

discopooh
28-12-2011, 05:16 PM
dont know if this is any good in the sale £19.99

http://www.screwfix.com/p/titan-ttb289sdr-random-orbit-sander-230v/46113?_requestid=60010

Orbit diameter: 2.5mm seems alittle on the small size

stephen2982
29-03-2012, 11:37 PM
i have the same question as furkin, so what is the verdict for a alternative DA to the g220? does one actually exist that is any good for paint correction?

joshtbh
31-03-2012, 12:35 PM
would also like to know please! :)

Nath
31-03-2012, 03:13 PM
I have just bought a Clarke Cros-1 orbital sander. I wanted a DA for applying glazes etc but use the rotary to correct so didn't want to spend much on a DA. The clarke sander is quite good to be honest, i tried correcting an area on my new van, which it did very well, although i did have to use to firmer pad and polish than i would usually select on this type of paint. However, it does take a long long time to fully break down the polish compared to the rotary, i got bored after a while and did the van with the rotary in the end - i've never used a DA though so i'm not sure how they compare to the DAS6 or G220.

To me, i would say you could get a decent level of correction with one, but be prepare to take a long time to do it :)

stephen2982
07-04-2012, 11:10 PM
is the clark similar spec to a DAS6 or PRO?

maersk
08-04-2012, 02:43 PM
similar but smaller orbit.

stephen2982
11-04-2012, 02:35 AM
so are they any cheaper alternatives to the DAS models?

stephen2982
20-05-2012, 11:07 PM
hello? revival

greymda
13-03-2014, 12:10 PM
what pad size should be used with the Mac?

greymda
04-04-2014, 12:15 PM
nobody is selling a macallister?