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Machine Polishing Need help with Machine polishing

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Old 22-09-2017, 04:58 PM   #1
Raptor_F22
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What am I doing wrong?

Okay so to answer my own thread title - probably a lot of things, but please can someone point out specifics or just share some words of wisdom?

I have a battered old Toyota Yaris which I recently bought, I don't think the previous owner has ever washed inside or out (the wannabe detailer in me spotted an opportunity of course...) so the paintwork is buggered. Full of scratches, swirls, RDS etc. Naturally I thought I'd give it a go at using my DA polisher rather than attack my luxury Jaaaag whilst I'm still learning - I've watched a lot of "how to" youtube videos and read a few guides on DW on how to machine polish, trying to put it into practise now.

So my setup is:
- Ultimate finish DA polisher speed settings (1 to 6)
- Koch Chemie yellow polishing pad for heavy cut
- Koch Chemie orange waffle pad for heavy/medium cut
- Scholl concepts S30 Gold XXL (aggressive cut)
- GTechniq P1 (finishing)
- GTechniq QD

Limitations:
- Doing it outdoors in the sun so no controlled lighting set up
- No paint depth gauge
- No decent camera to take pics, just my smartphone

My method:
1) Clay bar the panel first
2) Prime the yellow pad with QD
3) Apply S30 compound to pad and cover small section of a panel at speed setting of 1
4) Start initial pass at speed setting of 2-3
5) Apply pressure and begin increasing speed to 4
6) After 3rd pass increase speed to 5-6
7) After 3 passes at higher speed and when compound has broken down, start decreasing speed and complete 1-2 more passes
8) Wipe off panel
9) Repeat with orange waffle pad and Gtechniq P1

Okay so ignoring the fact that getting up close and personal I realised the car has definitely been in an accident and/or badly resprayed, I didn't think doing the steps above would still leave imperfections in the paint.
I took my time with each panel, tried not to rush but still couldn't remove all the swirls/scratches.

I also found that when the light hit the car at a different angle after I'd finished, on one of the panels I could see hologramming

Any tips/advice on what I'm doing wrong? I've lost confidence as I thought Jap cars had really soft paint so now I don't want to go anywhere near my jag's paintwork.

Some pics below which may help but apologies for lack of quality:

Before










After











Also - what can be done about this monstrosity? All it did was ruin my yellow pad as I stupidly thought it wouldn't be a problem to cut through the areas without clearcoat - in the end my efforts made absolutely no difference to this panel anyway.



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Old 22-09-2017, 05:33 PM   #2
Robbi Hong Kong
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You've got some pretty aggressive compounds and pad combinations.....

To be using such aggressive combo's on your soft paint without a paint meter is asking for trouble IMHO...

You should always do a full chemical decontamination also prior to any clay barring...so full tar and iron decontamination....

You should always start with the least aggressive and do a test area....also you can easily marr soft paint just by simply wiping the polish residue off so you need to be careful....

Technique and experience makes a huge difference to the way any pad and polish combo's work also....

You do not really need to be cranking up the machine to max.....start slow speed and relatively quick arm movement to spread the compound, then medium pressure for say 90 seconds to work the compound then say 90 seconds no pressure to refine...check results and if needed repeat....

You also need to be cleaning your pad thoroughly after each 2 x 2 section...this will remove spent polish and clearcoat residue...

In my opinion Sonax Perfect finish would be ideal for your soft paint together with Yellow Rupes Polishing pad...( this won't remove deep scratches tho....can you feel the scratches with your fingernail? if you can they are deep and require a more specialised approach )

The last image is clearcoat failure I'm afraid...its the body shop for that to be rectified....

I hope the above helps somewhat...I'm aware I have not answered all of your questions as time is short for me but i'm sure someone will be along to offer you more in depth advice going forward.....do not be disheartened at this stage as you say you are new but you will only improve with experience and guidance. Good Luck going forward...

Last edited by Robbi Hong Kong; 22-09-2017 at 05:50 PM.
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Old 22-09-2017, 06:18 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robbi Hong Kong View Post
You've got some pretty aggressive compounds and pad combinations.....

To be using such aggressive combo's on your soft paint without a paint meter is asking for trouble IMHO...

You should always do a full chemical decontamination also prior to any clay barring...so full tar and iron decontamination....

You should always start with the least aggressive and do a test area....also you can easily marr soft paint just by simply wiping the polish residue off so you need to be careful....

Technique and experience makes a huge difference to the way any pad and polish combo's work also....

You do not really need to be cranking up the machine to max.....start slow speed and relatively quick arm movement to spread the compound, then medium pressure for say 90 seconds to work the compound then say 90 seconds no pressure to refine...check results and if needed repeat....

You also need to be cleaning your pad thoroughly after each 2 x 2 section...this will remove spent polish and clearcoat residue...

In my opinion Sonax Perfect finish would be ideal for your soft paint together with Yellow Rupes Polishing pad...( this won't remove deep scratches tho....can you feel the scratches with your fingernail? if you can they are deep and require a more specialised approach )

The last image is clearcoat failure I'm afraid...its the body shop for that to be rectified....

I hope the above helps somewhat...I'm aware I have not answered all of your questions as time is short for me but i'm sure someone will be along to offer you more in depth advice going forward.....do not be disheartened at this stage as you say you are new but you will only improve with experience and guidance. Good Luck going forward...
Thank you that's really interesting - I wish I had some better pictures to show you the before and after of the paintwork, perhaps that would give better idea as to whether it's my method which is causing the issue.

What resonates is that I agree, it's an aggressive compound and pad combination for soft paint but still took me a long time and lots of pressure to remove the imperfections I saw. Hopefully I can grab some test panels and have another stab at it

And yes - I can feel some of them with my fingernail. Others are obviously are a different ball game and need touch up paint to hide as the scratch has gone down to the metal.

When you say clean the pad after each 2 x 2 section, how exactly should I go about doing that?
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Old 22-09-2017, 06:21 PM   #4
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Most of it's been said in the anpve post,most omportantly you need to find some one who is experienced at machine polishing and I mean exprienced not some one who has picked up a machine and done a few cars,and see how they do things,the pads you're using are aggresive and may not suit the polish pad combination the hologramms are due to you not finnishing down properly (not working the compund enough needs you working it for longer to completely diminish the abrasives in the product) maybe you'll need another finishing pad and polish combination to remove the holograms,
Don't lose heart,Rome wasn't built in a day,detailing is a painstaking and time consuming art and not meant for the impatient sorts,the more you do it the nore knowledge you'll gain and the better you'll becomem,may take time but you'll eventually get there with a bit of luck.
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Old 22-09-2017, 06:25 PM   #5
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https://www.youtube.com/results?q=cl...oDAA%253D%253D
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Old 22-09-2017, 06:26 PM   #6
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I could go into much more depth but like i said this forum is full of great people whom will steer you in the right direction.

You need to get a pad cleaning brush...turn the machine on and run the brush over the pad...you'll be amazed at what comes out.....Polished Bliss have some and they have free delivery too which is a bonus!....keeping your pads clean is paramount to getting a great finished result.

When you've finished spray some APC onto your pads and work out the remaining residue....under a tap with warm water and air dry...if you maintain your pads correctly they will last a long time.
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Old 22-09-2017, 06:53 PM   #7
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Thanks guys you've both been really helpful!

I've been trying for over 2 years to get some professional training under my belt but it hasn't happened for a few reasons.

Hopefully i'll get onto a course soon and as you mentioned, learn from a pro. I suppose it's why I started with the Yaris, I don't mind what happens to it, it's just good to learn for now.
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Old 22-09-2017, 09:11 PM   #8
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Scholl S 30 is finishing diminishing polish, Gtech P1 is heavy cutting SMAT compound.

Last edited by pawlik; 22-09-2017 at 09:16 PM.
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Old 22-09-2017, 09:26 PM   #9
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I find P1 a little hard to work with as it seems to dry out quite quickly - appreciate you can prime a pad with QD and/or re-activate the panel with water but i've found it harder to use because of that.
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Old 22-09-2017, 09:32 PM   #10
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That is the nature of some heavy cut compounds
They dry up and dust very quickly

Working in smaller sections can help with this, or after a few passes you could spray with a little QD to help revive it all for refining the compound for a few passes.



Sent by a phone of some description!
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