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Old 13-09-2017, 06:39 PM   #11
OvEr_KiLL
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its mostly about the prep as said. but i reckon a wax does have a slight type of finish as they all have different ingredients etc.
is an expensive wax worth it? well thats up to you, how much you want to spend and the usability/durability of the wax, color, scent, pot type, brand name, type of finish wether you want a full on gloss show wax that lasts 2 months or a wax that leaves a deeper finish with 6 months durability etc.
the maximum i have paid for a wax is probably £70 so far and i wouldnt pay much more as i have found 3 i like and are happy with them so why should i buy another wax when i wax every 6 months just to stick in a cupboard and look at it?

Last edited by OvEr_KiLL; 13-09-2017 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 13-09-2017, 07:07 PM   #12
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Can I put my name down for a pot of UltraNinja SuperWax please?

In all honesty some of my cheaper waxes are the ones I think were overpriced. Rarely do you have to pay full price for anything, but it should be true that anything you buy should be for a good reason and you can justify the expense.
The perception of value is subjective and relative.
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Old 14-09-2017, 05:10 AM   #13
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Great thread.

I've posted elsewhere that IMHO we are probably more like artists and sculptors than scientists.

Artists have their favourite make of brush and paints.

They also have vast ranges of both experience and money available to purchase products.

We have our polishes and waxes (and APC's, and snow foams, and wheel cleaners and microfibres and ..............)

So, each to their own, with their own likes and dislikes and budgets.

Tremendously helpful to have an honest opinion from "those in the know" about which products do what. I prefer the "what" to someone else's idea of "best" because their "best" might not be mine.

So is a wax durable? Easy to apply & buff off? Apply like if cost ££££££'s per square mm or be relatively generous? What about the smell? Is it really glossy? How does it bead? Etc.Etc.

So is a ££££££'s wax "better" than a ££'s wax? That'll be down to your preferences and circumstances.

Good point about them spending a considerable length of time in a cupboard. How quickly do most of us get through a full pot of wax? I've got a couple of pots and don't see myself needing any more anytime soon. Might want some more though........

Andy.

PS When is UltraNinja SuperWax(TM) being given away as a freebie for pre sale user feedback and development?????? I'm up for that.

Last edited by AndyN01; 14-09-2017 at 05:14 AM.
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Old 14-09-2017, 05:18 AM   #14
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I'm glad you think our products are good value. They actually retail in Japan for about half the price that Europeans pay, most of the price goes on transport, distribution, and the various import/export procedures and obligations.

Are they worth it? ...is a highly subjective question. I have a lot to say about this hahah

The answer is 100% how you feel about the product. Except for durability, all the aspects of a wax product are sensory experiences. It's like selling food or music or clothes.

What I can tell you is that the ingredients are not expensive. I'm a trained chemist, so I could never bring myself to pay £100s for a mixture of chemicals I know cost a tenner to make. However, most people are not chemists, and they are paying for an experience, not a mixture of chemicals.

That said, I'm sure I have paid £50 for shirts that cost £1 or less to make. The build quality will probably be better than a 20 quid shirt, and it might even look better. But mens clothes are pretty simple. The price is mostly branding.

For anyone concerned about some technical details, i.e. not knowing things is negatively affecting your waxing experience, I'll try to list some facts that might help:

1. Carnauba, various Hybrids, various Sealants, and coatings all look different, and look different on different cars. Choose a look that you like. Carnauba for deep dark gloss, sealants for glassy shine, ceramic coatings to make your black car look white haha, etc. But what makes you happy to see on your car? is the only meaningful question really.

2. There is no difference in appearance between the various 100% carnauba waxes. Even the purest Carnauba wax is not very expensive.

3. The things that make the more expensive waxes unique are additives like oils and perfumes, and packaging. These do not protect the paint or affect appearance. They are there to aid application, enhance the sensory experience during use, and to make the wax sound/look cooler.

4. The additives and packaging are not particularly expensive materials. Customers are paying for the design and selection of them. Also, how many pots of wax do you think you'll sell if you price it at £100s!? Not many. No economy of scale

If knowing this kind of info changes how you feel about waxes, it will change how "worth it" they are for you. Personally, I can't really relate to the people who want to pay 100s for that experience, but I like to dine out, and I pay good money for that experience.

The food is not necessarily better at a more expensive restaurant, but I appreciate the decor, the service, the music... I'm probably enchanted with things I don't even pay attention to, like the menu design or cutlery! Probably even affected by the name. This probably makes the food taste different. But then, it could just be my tongue's condition that day, or the humidity in the room....
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Old 14-09-2017, 08:55 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyN01 View Post
PS When is UltraNinja SuperWax(TM) being given away as a freebie for pre sale user feedback and development?????? I'm up for that.
Took the words out of my mouth...

Any news on the freebie developers Beta version for review?



PS Call me tight if you like but I'm in no rush to increase my wax spend until I've used up ALL of my tin of DSW

PPS I googled Ultimate Ninja Super Wax and found this...



UNSW FTW!


Last edited by Forsh; 14-09-2017 at 09:35 AM.
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Old 14-09-2017, 09:20 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shelton View Post
I'm glad you think our products are good value. They actually retail in Japan for about half the price that Europeans pay, most of the price goes on transport, distribution, and the various import/export procedures and obligations.

Are they worth it? ...is a highly subjective question. I have a lot to say about this hahah

The answer is 100% how you feel about the product. Except for durability, all the aspects of a wax product are sensory experiences. It's like selling food or music or clothes.

What I can tell you is that the ingredients are not expensive. I'm a trained chemist, so I could never bring myself to pay £100s for a mixture of chemicals I know cost a tenner to make. However, most people are not chemists, and they are paying for an experience, not a mixture of chemicals.

That said, I'm sure I have paid £50 for shirts that cost £1 or less to make. The build quality will probably be better than a 20 quid shirt, and it might even look better. But mens clothes are pretty simple. The price is mostly branding.

For anyone concerned about some technical details, i.e. not knowing things is negatively affecting your waxing experience, I'll try to list some facts that might help:

1. Carnauba, various Hybrids, various Sealants, and coatings all look different, and look different on different cars. Choose a look that you like. Carnauba for deep dark gloss, sealants for glassy shine, ceramic coatings to make your black car look white haha, etc. But what makes you happy to see on your car? is the only meaningful question really.

2. There is no difference in appearance between the various 100% carnauba waxes. Even the purest Carnauba wax is not very expensive.

3. The things that make the more expensive waxes unique are additives like oils and perfumes, and packaging. These do not protect the paint or affect appearance. They are there to aid application, enhance the sensory experience during use, and to make the wax sound/look cooler.

4. The additives and packaging are not particularly expensive materials. Customers are paying for the design and selection of them. Also, how many pots of wax do you think you'll sell if you price it at £100s!? Not many. No economy of scale

If knowing this kind of info changes how you feel about waxes, it will change how "worth it" they are for you. Personally, I can't really relate to the people who want to pay 100s for that experience, but I like to dine out, and I pay good money for that experience.

The food is not necessarily better at a more expensive restaurant, but I appreciate the decor, the service, the music... I'm probably enchanted with things I don't even pay attention to, like the menu design or cutlery! Probably even affected by the name. This probably makes the food taste different. But then, it could just be my tongue's condition that day, or the humidity in the room....
I have to say I think this is one of the best and most objective posts I have read on this subject

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Old 14-09-2017, 12:35 PM   #17
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I agree Taxboy
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Old 14-09-2017, 12:58 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shelton View Post
A lot of sensible things
Whilst I agree with a lot of what shelton says here, it's worth remembering the difference between the really large scale outfits like Soft99, Sonax etc (who are selling many thousands of units on a daily basis, can buy materials in huge bulk etc) and the sole traders who do the production, R&D etc in small quantities and need to recoup those costs over smaller unit volumes - ie the difference in economies of scale.

In a similar vein, the point about ingredients not being that expensive does apply to the things that go into normal waxes, it doesn't necessarily apply to some of the more exotic stuff - and again, you have to buy some of it to cover the R&D, as a small producer you have a smaller number of units to recoup that cost.

Cashflow is what kills off most small businesses, and this means there are other effects such as whether or not a small business can afford to have a lot of money tied up in ingredients (even if buying in larger quantities would save money).
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Old 14-09-2017, 01:06 PM   #19
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I agree Taxboy


Agreed. Great post.


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Old 14-09-2017, 01:36 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shelton View Post
I'm glad you think our products are good value. They actually retail in Japan for about half the price that Europeans pay, most of the price goes on transport, distribution, and the various import/export procedures and obligations.

Are they worth it? ...is a highly subjective question. I have a lot to say about this hahah

The answer is 100% how you feel about the product. Except for durability, all the aspects of a wax product are sensory experiences. It's like selling food or music or clothes.

What I can tell you is that the ingredients are not expensive. I'm a trained chemist, so I could never bring myself to pay £100s for a mixture of chemicals I know cost a tenner to make. However, most people are not chemists, and they are paying for an experience, not a mixture of chemicals.

That said, I'm sure I have paid £50 for shirts that cost £1 or less to make. The build quality will probably be better than a 20 quid shirt, and it might even look better. But mens clothes are pretty simple. The price is mostly branding.

For anyone concerned about some technical details, i.e. not knowing things is negatively affecting your waxing experience, I'll try to list some facts that might help:

1. Carnauba, various Hybrids, various Sealants, and coatings all look different, and look different on different cars. Choose a look that you like. Carnauba for deep dark gloss, sealants for glassy shine, ceramic coatings to make your black car look white haha, etc. But what makes you happy to see on your car? is the only meaningful question really.

2. There is no difference in appearance between the various 100% carnauba waxes. Even the purest Carnauba wax is not very expensive.

3. The things that make the more expensive waxes unique are additives like oils and perfumes, and packaging. These do not protect the paint or affect appearance. They are there to aid application, enhance the sensory experience during use, and to make the wax sound/look cooler.

4. The additives and packaging are not particularly expensive materials. Customers are paying for the design and selection of them. Also, how many pots of wax do you think you'll sell if you price it at £100s!? Not many. No economy of scale

If knowing this kind of info changes how you feel about waxes, it will change how "worth it" they are for you. Personally, I can't really relate to the people who want to pay 100s for that experience, but I like to dine out, and I pay good money for that experience.

The food is not necessarily better at a more expensive restaurant, but I appreciate the decor, the service, the music... I'm probably enchanted with things I don't even pay attention to, like the menu design or cutlery! Probably even affected by the name. This probably makes the food taste different. But then, it could just be my tongue's condition that day, or the humidity in the room....
What a post, great stuff!

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